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RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

TheBlueliner — Wed, 31 Mar 2010 02:49:11 GMT

Coming in late to this, but has there ever been talk about building an arena for Western basketball?

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

westerwind dad — Wed, 27 Jan 2010 21:20:29 GMT

There are two things that scare me, someone thinking we should go Division II and Carnies.! HA

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Wed, 27 Jan 2010 20:48:43 GMT

Thanks Hail Leathernecks. I completely agree with you. We have the potential, given the overall weakness of our conference, to continue to excel and possibly get further into the tournament with both soccer teams. Softball is another sport with a history of success and a young, motivated, personable coach who can continue to carry on the winning tradition she participated in and added too. Tennis has had consistent success similar to soccer.

What makes people think we can fix our programs enabling us to compete and succeed at the D1 level, but that we'd be unable to be successful at the DII level? That makes no logical sense unless you are so mesmerized or stupified by the weakness of our conference you think it is best to be the strongest of the weakest in the D1 landscape. The bottom line is what do we want the experience to be for our athletes? I have asked this question repeatedly in the last couple of months. Division I in name and NAIA in reality?

Introspection is difficult. Change is even harder. Division I in name isn't prestigious in and of itself when you spend your holidays and evenings during the winter hawking hot dogs, pop corn and pork chop sandwiches at every home basketball game until 9 pm at night. Did these kids sign up to become carnies, bound by schedules of other programs and a desperate need to finance horrifically underfunded programs in a sport that spends much of its season on the road due to our weather? This isn't Division I, it's a circus. The Ringmaster has lost touch with reality and needs to be gone...NOW. Until WIU makes a decision to make a move back towards its mission and charge in the State educational system, we will continue to have these conversations. Saying We're Number 1 doesn't make us #1. Lack of leadership erodes healthy communities and WIU and the Macomb community have suffered long enough at the inept hands of the people in charge at all levels in the athletic department. You want success? You want winners? You want to stay Division I? Move forward to save your school and DEMAND CHANGE NOW. We desperately need leadership at the top (Johnson, TVA, Roche, et al and at the mid management level in some of our sports (see thread under the Westerwinds heading).

We all are part of the voice of the program but general apathy has made us powerless and insignificant. People who give money MUST revolt, stop giving, stop advertising, stop donating in kind. What do you really get for all that anyway besides a tax deduction? I would love to hear business people talk about that some time. Give to other places if you need a write off until your voices are heard. Give to academic programs or intramurals or the arts, anything to make your voice heard. Until that happens we are emasculating ourselves and have only to point our fingers in the mirror.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Hail Leathernecks — Mon, 25 Jan 2010 13:08:55 GMT

Necks, I think that when the field is actually cut the turf is great.. My comment was on the field not being cut or lined for home games. It was a complete and utter joke. That is a very serious issue and shows a total lack of oversight. In regards to not having state money EIU has much nicer facilities than we do with practicaly the same situation. State funds or not we do not adress common sense issues the first time through. It ends up costing way more money in the long run.

LY, I suppose you are right about game changing elite athletes. I don't think WIU is competiting with Miami U for players though. Honestly WIU is never going to get those athletes even with full seats and great facilities. That is the reason I think the argument is bogus. However, there are a ton of kids that would jump at the chance to play at this level. I think the second part of your post was much more the reason for WIU's lack of success. WIU could offer a much better atmosphere but from day one students are told athletics is not very good and a waste of time.

I crushed a list of what was needed facility wise to make soccer compete every year for conference championships (ohh they already do, lets reward them) and it honestly isn't even that much money compared to other projects.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Sun, 24 Jan 2010 21:17:59 GMT

Hail Leathernecks: My comments are not dissimilar from those of Illinineck, fan56, and several others. Ouch. Too close to home for you? If kids will only come when the stands are filled, they aren't interested in WESTERN. Players interested in WESTERN will come because they want to come here, get a DEGREE from WESTERN and they feel they can make a difference. While someone like Wyatt Green may have had that dream (and that's great he did make a difference, he is a wonderful example of local recruiting and his family was from very close), the game changers don't dream of coming to WIU.

As long as we have crummy facilities, tyrannical leadership, directionless fundraising, and abusive coaches we will continue to under perform our resources (our TRUE resources are our dedicated faculty and academic programs that will ultimately lead to better jobs and better lives for those that want to come to WIU to get an education and play sports. Hence the term, student-athlete).

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Neckfansince71 — Sun, 24 Jan 2010 10:26:00 GMT

I had the opportunity to talk with a former soccer player from the early 70's who played in the alumni game this past fall. He said that the playing surface was absolutely the best he had ever seen, even in the soccer crazy St. Louis area. Of course the stands are another story.

When it comes to infrastructure, the administration at WIU has done a great job keeping things together without a lot of support from the state. I am totally embarrassed by the state's support for our universities. I really don't think we will see any movement on the stadium until this is fixed. Can't build a new stadium when other things are being bandaided together. This too shall pass!

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Hail Leathernecks — Sun, 24 Jan 2010 02:13:38 GMT

Nobody donates money because they don't have a relationship that makes them feel compelled to give back. I hate the move to DII but I sure do bring it up a lot to show the honest situation we are in. I think we would be out gunned in DII anyway with current staff and facilities. Fix it and stay DI. We just need new leadership and realistic goals. Soccer is a sport we can actually win the conference in and we neglect it. I feel bad for EJ because he is a good coach and person working miracles while other WIU teams act like JV squads.

LY the comments you made were off topic and silly. Kids grow up wanting to play college athletics all across the world. WIU with a full stadium sure would be in the dreams of a lof of young atheltes I know.

Like I said with the soccer players giving back money after they leave to pay for the facilities they never had..... You make them drive all over in vans and don't give the a cut field for games and don't have a locker room that is up to snuff and you don't give them full scholarships and the AD doesn't make it to many games and and and and I can keep going. Fix the stupid field. We can actually win consistantly in soccer and market it..... Wow what a novel idea marketing athletic success. It wouldn't even come close to a million dollars to do it the right way which is very different from other teams needing upgrades that never seem to make the NCAA tourney anyway. Ohh and this will help Title IX (womens soccer) which will allow for swim and dive to be dropped like it should be so that we can fully scholarship the other programs. Get with it people. Set goals and reach them.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

mr_wiu — Mon, 21 Dec 2009 02:43:11 GMT

Hard to believe I'm saying this, but I actually agree with LY about the crumbling infrastructure on campus. We do have a serious maintenance backlog. Something to do with the governor hanging on to capital improvement funds for the last bazillion years until he was finally ousted, right?!!?

Donors, like it or not, don't want to give their money to repair buildings. They want new buildings (or new fields) with their names attached. So, you can't expect the funds from the capital campaign to go towards that. Is it a serious problem and a need? Yes, but funding for that is going to have to come from the state capital improvement list, I think....

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 08:59:15 GMT

See response under Sports Lounge since this started as a discussion on fields, turf and soccer

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Neckfansince71 — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 08:42:39 GMT

As a well coached former basketball player would, I followed you to the basket to make sure you scored but there was absolutely no need because you "slam dunked it" with your reply! And thanks 177 for your observations as a university employee!

I have grown tired of this discussion and last night "swore" that I would cease to participate in it but I had to show my approval of both of these posts!

A number of football recruits are on campus today for visits! As Gene Hackman stated in Hoosiers, "make it a good one Strap!"

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

western-101 — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 08:13:15 GMT

This post moved to the Sports Lounge.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

leatherneck177 — Sat, 05 Dec 2009 01:32:05 GMT

Yocal, stop trying to pick on an athletic department that is feeling the recession. As is every other athletic department in the country that is not in a BCS conference (and at times, so of those are in BCS conferences). Having worked at a state institution, I can tell you that nearly every athletic department runs in the red on an annual basis. Once you get outside of the BCS conferences, these programs are typically there to enhance the collegiate experience.

You should be proud of the fact that Western is able to field a program that puts teams out at the Division I level, the highest level of competition in the NCAA. The football team has their SINGLE worst season, record wise in the history of the school and everybody is going nuts. Western draws well when the team performs well, just like nearly every other school that sponsors athletics. However a glaring problem would be if they were drawing poorly while the team was playing well. SIU has won consistenly of late, however they still don't draw any fans.

Stop with your comparisions on the transfers, that has nothing to do with D-II and to be honest, neither does football. There are several other sports, and while football may have the largest budget, Western is tagged as a "football" school. Unfortunately in your mind, their success has labeled the school in this manner.

Stop trying to push Western into a D-II level that makes no sense. If you've ever worked in athletics you would understand the entire situation.

It's funny how these issues were so quiet when the teams were competitive.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 21:08:04 GMT

WIU 712, is your question a rhetorical one?

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

WIU712 — Fri, 04 Dec 2009 07:39:32 GMT

Very well stated, Lokal Yokal.

The only question to ask is: Is Tim Van Alstine the leader that we need to start the transition to Division 2 or should a new person be brought in ?????

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 22:08:24 GMT

Traveling stinks sometimes, even in the computer age. Nice to see some new comments. Look for a new head track coach very soon. Tip of the day.

Yes, WIU needs to compete at the DII level for a variety of reasons...where would I start? It is about more than money. The money we have now just makes us a school with some money, without adequate resources to compete across the board in DI.

Let's talk about FB players who transferred to WIU, for example. Would money have made the receiver RJ Luke (who started his career at Penn State) a few years back select us in the first place instead of transferring to us after he got in trouble with the law in PA? If you think so you are in a dream world because you are correlating WIU with PSU in the Big Ten. Similarly, would Will Ducey have chosen WIU over Mississippi (an SEC Team) from the outset? Hellooooo, I said SEC, the Southeastern Conference. A different universe, even in Oxford, MS. What about the fellow that transferred to WIU from Wisconsin (a Big Ten team) a few years back, Aaron Stecker? Would money have made him choose WIU over UW Madison and Camp Randall? Smell the coffee, it is strong and black, even made by the former QB at Adams Street especially for dreamers. Would money have made Abe Koroma, (transferred from Penn State, a Big Ten team), choose WIU as his first choice? Disclaimer, I'm not talking about how good or bad any of these players were or turned out to be, just that they made choices out of high school or JuCo based on their DREAMS.

These players selected their schools because it was their dream to play big time college football somewhere. They dreamed of playing in bowl games and before 85-110 thousand cheering people on Saturday afternoons. I'm sorry but no amount of money will make WIU into one of those programs. A Chevy will always be a Chevy, not a Cadillac. I'm not trying to be offensive or degrade out athletes. They work hard and they seem committed to WIU. They are excited to be here so lets make their experience a good one, one that they'll cherish instead of one that leaves them eager to leave.

I could go on and on but it stresses me. The only major difference money could make is in enabling WIU to hire a professional athletic director with the vision to LEAD us into a future of success instead of driving us further into the ground as division one aspirants. What is so wrong with being successful at Division II, having fans in the stands, running in the black, gaining respect among a group of schools who are concerned with the experience athletes GAIN from a program rather than any experience they BRING to a program?

You talk about money from soccer players. What a joke. How much money have football alums given to this sinking ship? Men who play on Sunday, in the NFL making a minimum of 310,000 dollars a year without signing bonuses, multiple year contracts, etc. What about those playing four to six years making $620,000 and so on. This is just the bare minimum. Do you think Rodney Harrison, Aaron Stecker, Brian Cox, Mike Scifres and a number of others the program loves to brag on only make the minimum? What are they donating? I don't know, look it up in the annual givers edition from Advancement and Public Services. Of course it isn't their job to keep the program running. Monies from them should be icing on the cake, not sustenance. Oh, BTW, have we heard yet WHAT THE PURPLE AND GOLD AUCTION MADE THIS AUGUST? Still no report? Gosh, is it because revenue is down significantly? If you want to complain about money, look at what we are doing and assess that instead of chasing paper tigers.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Hail Leathernecks — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 11:36:09 GMT

Does the mean you support a move to DII Lokal?

Not having enough money to do anything with athletics or on campus academic buildings would be a clear sign WIU is in over their heads. They could at least fully scholarship at the DII and our facilities wouldn't be the doormat of the state of conference any more.

There is a limit to raising funds. WIU doesn't provide a good experience to soccer players with scholarships, facilities, travel, etc... if you want a former player to give back then treat them like student athletes while they are here. Ohh and get a few people together that can actually raise interest in athletics.

WIU doesn't see athletics as a useful tool so it has become lost in the shuffle. Maybe if they would invest into athletics and market them like other school have successfully they would get more than they ever dreamed from it.

FYI because of the track set up I am pretty sure that soccer can't move to Hanson Field. Besides it would be a terrible playing environment. Can we please start doing things right for once?

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Leatherface — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 20:31:29 GMT

Thanks, guys. This is getting better than most of the WESTERN games this past fall.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 19:17:10 GMT

NecksFan71. I like your suggestion regarding a fund raising event I have looked at the donor book and understand the "silent" phase is supposed to be ending. It is also public knowledge we are currently searching for a new VP in Advancement and Public Services (doing a real search, the prescribed way. Something athletics knows nothing about), and that while on paper we might, or are supposed to have, half of the total, we have very creative accounting methods. All of the gifts in kind are counted at face value (that is, no money changes hands), AND more importantly, planned giving is counted as money in the bank for the fiscal year a gift is designated. Soooo, all of the people who have earmarked monies from their future deaths in their wills for good old WIU is money we might not see for 5,10,15 or twenty years in the future. We're counting it in fiscal year 10 though. Oh, did I mention most of those future gifts are not binding? The donor could get ticked off by some sassy coach who is disrespectful and not give WIU a single penny when his/her time comes.

Have you been on a tour of building and facilities on campus lately? We have buildings falling apart. Go to Waggoner (first floor lounge off the east entrance), Currens, Stipes, the Library, Physical Plant, Brown, Simpkins and don't forget our wonderful Union. Ask people who work there, students and guests what they think of the condition of their buildings. 60 million won't begin to cover it. Where should our priorities be? Classrooms, living spaces for students, offices, research laboratories, or, artificial turf for a field that is used so sparsely. What sort of schedule would be necessary to make the space at Hanson as useful as a classroom in say, Stipes, Morgan, Currens, or Waggoner Halls? How many electronic journal subscriptions could we purchase for the use of our students for the cost of 120+ yards of synthetic green carpet? While you are walking around campus taking your tour, be sure to walk on the sidewalks that are crumbling, the stairs that are roped off and drive on the roads that are so full of pot holes from the buses they could break a tie rod or ball joint.

This isn't trying to be negative, I'm trying to be realistic. We are in a time of crisis and major changes need to be made in order to lead WIU athletics into a more prosperous, financially sound era. Fiscal responsibility should be required of State employees at all levels. Why should athletics be any different? Because they have the world's most captive cash cows walking obliviously around campus? (students) LOOK at the salaries in the athletic department. Go to the library and ask to see the salaries of university employees or look them up on-line. What and where are our priorities? Who is the voice of reason? Labeling reality as being negative is a strategy to use smoke and mirrors to hide the truth. Plain and simple. Take the bull by the horns. Put the future of WIU athletics and the university in perspective and decide what you can't live without, and what you give up for the greater good.

It is easy, sexy and agressive to say athletics is the front door of the university but sad when the front door is falling off its hinges.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

WIU712 — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 18:27:58 GMT

Welcome back, Leatherface !!

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Leatherface — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 17:34:56 GMT

I believe I'll start posting again- just to pi$$ off some of the long time posters I use to irritate!

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Neckfansince71 — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 17:00:29 GMT

This coming fall the university will be kicking off a $60,000,000 campaign with 15million going to facilities. The information regarding this campaign can be found in the 2009 Gift and Grant Honor Roll booklet that university donors receive each year. This campaign has been in the silent phase for the last couple of years which means that now since they are going public, they have already received large gifts totaling half or $30,000,000! You can't tell me that the cost of field turf could not be found in that amount!

Maybe, since you have pointed out the inadequacies of the athletic departments fund gathering abilities, you and I should chair a major fund raising campaign for athletics!!!!! I have the positive outlook for such work and you obviously have some much needed suggestions and thought in this matter.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Lokal Yokal — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 13:29:59 GMT

Who and how are they going to pay for turf? The reality of athletics at WIU is there are minimal donors, no effective large scale fund-raising and needs out the wazooo. Oh, did I mention a program that is already running in RED ink? Putting the cost of turf into student fees, couched as an opportunity to use the field during off times would be a travesty. The student body would wake up with such a financial hang over if that was approved it wouldn't be funny. The reality of it is the money doesn't exist. If some major donor steps up, fine do it, but don't burden the rest of the campus with decisions for facilities so sparsely used and for such elite (used by less than 200 student athletes in relation to a general student population of over 12,000) purposes.

RE: Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

arlen54 — Wed, 25 Nov 2009 11:22:54 GMT

NFS71...Enjoyed our chat the other night. I agree that I would like to see turf in Hanson Field. I was against it for years because I'm "old school" I guess. But, maybe it's time to get with the other schools in the league. Plus, it would serve as a multi-purpose facility while upgrading the soccer programs. It should be included in the overall renovation of Hanson Field. I know TVA has looked into the possibility of turf installation.

Soccer field refurbishing suggestion!

Neckfansince71 — Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:28:10 GMT

Hey, just a thought! I went on line today and looked up artificial field turf and found the website of the company that has put a lot of this stuff into many Universities and pro stadiums. I did this after I looked up the basic measurement requirements for football and soccer in college. Soccer fields in college can measure from 80 - 65 yards wide and 120-110 yards long. It means that the field of play is just alittle bit wider than football and almost the exact length. Sooooooooooo......lets put field turf into Hanson just like the University of West Virginia has done to service football, men's and women's soccer, and any other intramural event or events that can be played there. The lights would mean an morning, afternoon, and evening slot for usage, and teams could always practice on the other fields when necessary. I know the soccer team, men's needs locker space but there are plans to refurbish the Olympic Locker-room facilities in Western Hall already in the books. This would get three groups together to support both the field replacement and the pressbox upgrade!!! Okay, I drove to Peoria and back today to pick up my mother-in-law so I guess its "just my imagination, running away with me!" West Viginie's field turf looks great! Sorry I am just a very positive person!